No, but people picked when he's on his deathbed for an attack on his character as head of the church. That's right up there with spitting on someone's grave. Some people on here should be truly ashamed of themselves......

EDIT: Right now I'm so disgusted, I honestly feel like quitting the board outright.

Well thats up to you of course.

But you have to remember not everyone shares your point of view, whether it be right or wrong.

You could argue that they had no right to contribute to a thread about something which they disagree with in the first place, and maybe your right, but threads like this are bound to spark a difference of opinion.

Except that this isn't as simple as a difference of opinion this time. Ok, let me give you some perspective here. Imagine you had a distant relative you felt a connection with who was on their deathbed, and all people around you were doing was slagging off on them. On top of that, you had p[eople attacking you for your choicve of career and spiritual beliefs. How would you feel about it and how would you react?

QUOTE (Bowspearer @ Apr 02 2005, 06.32)

As someone training to be a primary school teacher at the moment, you're damn lucky you don't live that close to me, because right if you did live close by, you'd need people to hold me back from stabbing you rewpeatedly with a carving knife YOU SICK FUCK!!!!!!

You hypocrite coward. I point out truths about catholic priests and I'm the 'sick fuck'. Yea keep talking tough Lion. It makes me laugh.

Oh sure, every single catholic priest is pedophile. Youre really sick shitheaded retard.

Ahh, the Lion's drummer boy speaks. Did I say every priest? No, but the catholic religion has a lot to answer for. It seems they are not accountable for their actions and just have to say a couple of 'hail marys' and all's forgiven. You call me a sick shitheaded retard, but I don't fuck little boys. Who's the retard grimmy? You are a lost cause. I feel the Pope is genuinely a good man. He has appologised for many bad things that the church has done in the name of god. He is the only one to come forth and point out there is something wrong here.

QUOTE (Bowspearer @ Apr 02 2005, 07.12)

Except that this isn't as simple as a difference of opinion this time. Ok, let me give you some perspective here. Imagine you had a distant relative you felt a connection with who was on their deathbed, and all people around you were doing was slagging off on them. How would you feel about it and how would you react?

But no ones actually slagging off the Pope, just what he represents.

If people were talking badly about a relative I felt a connection to, then I may feel obliged to try and set them straight, then again I might not... that IS a difference of opinion.

In the end its how I remember that relative that matters, sure it would be disrespectful to bad mouth someone on their deathbed (but if people are doing that, then most certainly there would be a good reason why) I dont think anyone has done that here.

Look im not a Catholic, I'm not religious in anyway, I dont wish any ill will to the Pope, but to me his eventual passing will mean as much to me as someone dying in a retirement home thats reported in a local paper... sad, but I never knew them. Their not a relative to me.

I cant say my prayers are with him because I dont pray, and if I did, my prayers would most certainly be with many other people in the world first.

QUOTE (L.Ninio @ Apr 02 2005, 07.18)

You hypocrite coward. I point out truths about catholic priests and I'm the 'sick fuck'. Yea keep talking tough Lion. It makes me laugh.

STFU you moron! Most catholic schools out there don't have priests as teachers, and the new guard of priests could not be further from what you're talking about (in fact the whole application process for a person to become a priest was completely changed in an effort to combat pedophilia)! I know plenty of young priests who hate pedophilia as much as the next man! But hey I guess that's the thing with arrogance, when you argue with it you can make general sweeping statements without checking their validity! Oh and with how I was feeling at that time, it was anything BUT just tough talk! So I'd count myself lucky if I were you...

QUOTE (L.Ninio @ Apr 02 2005, 07.24)

Who's the retard grimmy? You are a lost cause.

YOURE THE LOST CAUSE AND YOURE THE RETARD, YOU PIECE OF SHIT!

I was expecting to have this thread be peaceful when I posted it. I had no idea that it would get rather nasty at times.

First of all, I'm not Catholic. At the same time, it doesn't mean that I have no respect for him. As a Christian, I have a geat deal of respect for him because of what he has done during his life. For example, he contributed to the fall of communism, especially in his native Poland. It was in the early '80's when the Polish communist government imposed martial law on its people.

His travels around the world gave inspiration and hope to people everywhere.

QUOTE (Primus @ Apr 02 2005, 07.25)

Look im not a Catholic, I'm not religious in anyway, I dont wish any ill will to the Pope, but to me his eventual passing will mean as much to me as someone dying in a retirement home thats reported in a local paper... sad, but I never knew them. Their not a relative to me.

As you said, you're not catholic, but I AM, and it IS like a relative passing for me! You say that there are no outright attacks on him, but you can't attack an organisation a person was the head of without saying something about them as obviously they have an influence on that organisation. The fact is that attacking someone on any level when they're on their death bed is downright disrespectful, and if someone is respectful to the dying and the dead, then they recognise there's a time and a place for some things to be said. Up unitl today, that was a respect I honestly thought people on here had. How wrong I was.....

QUOTE (Primus @ Apr 02 2005, 07.25)

I cant say my prayers are with him because I dont pray, and if I did, my prayers would most certainly be with many other people in the world first.

Your thoughts are appreciated.

QUOTE (L.Ninio @ Apr 02 2005, 07.24)

No, but the catholic religion has a lot to answer for. It seems they are not accountable for their actions and just have to say a couple of 'hail marys' and all's forgiven. You call me a sick shitheaded retard, but I don't fuck little boys.

A) the catholic church isn't the only place it's happened. Pedophilia happens everywhere. It's does not discriminate between race, religion or gender. The reason people are so incensed whan they encounter it in a church is because of the expectations they attach to a church. It's no different to the whole 'Pvt. Lynch/Abu Grabe' fiasco. B) if you even had the slightest respect for the dying and the dead you would have realised that there's a time and a place for some things to be said, and this is DEFINATELY not the time!

I wish him well, but the fact is he's dying and despite what people have tried, nothing's going to change that. I hope his passing is blessedly quick. I suppose you could say I do wish he was dead because no-one deserves to be kep alive in pain and suffering.

This may not be the time or place to comment on the catholic church, but if the subject is brought up, people will comment on it. People's opinions will differ and because of the Pope's condition, the subject is probably more in people's minds now than it ever has been.

You can't simply demand that people agree that the Pope is some great hero because to many he isn't and there are people in the world they feel far greater sympathy towards.

This Pope has made steps forward, but there is a long way to go before I change my opinions about the catholic church. And. sadly, as much as you might wish it, my views are not going to change because a frail old man is dying of old age.

Yes, but you have to understand it will always be the time and place with a subject like this because people are always opinionated.

Like ive already said, people that disagreed with the intentions of this thread probably should'nt have posted, but they did because its a battle of ideoligies, people like to have their opinions known.

Im not saying it was the right time to start a debate about the Catholic church, but this was bound to happen whether it was disrespectful or not.

I'm sorry, but if people had any respect for the Pope they'd just let him die in peace.

Frankly, I find the half hourly bullitens on every website I visit on the state of the Pope (He's almost gone, no, wait, he's recovered a bit, oh, now he's unconscious..) to be as extremely disrespectful and an invasion of privacy as you no doubt find my comments.

It's almost as sickening as the media frenzy over every last gasp of the Schavio case, where every second of her protracted and distressing death were broadcast every few minutes.

I don't honestly find the obsession with the poor guy's remaining hours on this earth being a matter of international scrutiny to be respectful anyway and since it's already beenopened up into a media frenzy I don't think discussion of his role and the church as a whole makes matters any worse.

Whatever shred of respect I had for you is now gone! If you have problems with media bulletins, take it up with those media organisations! The difference with those media broadcasts is that they haven't decided to air out the man's dirty laundry, or innappropriately decide to criticise the organisation he was the head of for nearly a quarter of a century, like people here have- people who are clearly such scum that they have no concept of ettiquette with regards to respecting the dying. Every single bulletin I have seen has been nothing but tasteful. This thread has been a true awakening to the character of some people on this board!

This isn't about people having no respect for the dying. This is about other people not having the same adoration of a specific individual as you do.

I'm sure if someone started a thread along the lines of "Robert Mugabe is dying of old age. Let's pray" then I'm sure you'd have no problems with people questioned his philosophy and/or intentions.

Actually I would! Like I said, one of the most fundamental respects a person can have is a respect for the dying/dead, where while you might not necessarily agree with their beliefs, their actions or their character, you at least allow them dignity by 'letting sleeping dogs lie' on their deathbed - and this is coming from someone who sat supportively next to his grandmother as she was slowly passing away while in organ shutdown after having major issues with her for his whole life. Now when a person doesn't have that respect, then not much can be said for their character!

I disagree. That sounds more like forgivness than respect, and seeing how I'm not the one directly harmed by said person's actions I have no right (or even reason) to offer that forgivness.

Let's move this up a notch. "Hitler found alive and well but dying of old age. Let's pray".

Yeah, I suppose you could pray for a last minute change of heart but would that stop you making further comments?